So one of my k5’s sounds like a dieing pig. So i decided im going to get it tuned.
I found out about Mike over at Horn&Whistle, and he sure does know his stuff. I have also heard his work and is amazing how darn close he gets horn to factory tune.
heres a vid of a k5la he tuned:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eESX49NQjAI
Today i am sending it off to California to have him work his magic.
Ill keep you guys posted on what mike finds. like the before tuning, and photos i get, and ect.
.
Would love to send mine out or better yet, learn how to tune.
Def keep us posted!
Subscribed!
Yeah, I’d be interested in finding out more about the tuning as well. Since the bells are pre-cast and tuned, I would imagine the only way to tune them would be to physically shape the bells (probably through grinding the bore of the bell).
There may be more to it, but I believe it has to do with the depth of the bore.
You can add shims or machine out material. Machining the bore deeper is self explanitory, but adding material could be done several ways.
As far as determining the actual tune, you can download a free program (such as Audacity) to see what frequency each bell is playing.
UPDATE FROM MIKE I have started working on your horn. Here are the notes it currently blows:
D#+20, F#-30, G#+20, B-20, D#-30
Based on the 5-bell and 2-bell both being ~ 30 cts flat, it makes the most sense (and is the most economical) to bias the entire tuning to the same degree of flatness, namely -30 cts. That means, that to properly octave match the 1 and 5 bell, the 1 will need to be bored out, the 2 bell and 5 bell left alone, and the 3A bell and 4A bell bored. It might even sound ok with the 4A bell left alone. That means that to get your K5LA sounding like it is supposed to sound, only three bells will need to be tuned. Biasing the tuning will make the whole horn slightly lower pitch, but every note will sound in correct relationship to every other note. So it looks like this horn will cost somewhere between $X and $X to tune unless I run into some unforeseen snag. If it sounds ok with the 4A left alone, I will let you know and you can decide if you want it adjusted. I highly recommend going with this approach.
If we were to try tuning to the exact notes of D# F# G# B D# the tuning would be much more expensive because shim sets would have to be made and installed on the 2, 4A, and 5 bells (already $X for the shim fabrication and installation), then all 5 bells would have to be tuned which would cost an additional $X to $X for a total of ~ $X to $X. And the thing is, it wouldn’t sound any better than if tuned using the simpler method described above. Simpler is better.
So what do you guys think?! I think to have it done all to -30cnts.
Sounds very logical. The perfect tune is a moving target anyway. It can change slightly with tank pressure and even atmospheric pressure, temp, & humidity.
When he says -30 cts, I assume he is talking Hz or cycles per second?
I would have no problem sending my horns to Mr Muha and saying “make em sound good.”
Cents is a term used to describe the pitch of a note, kinda like a sharp of flat.
for example the note “A” is 440Hz, and -30 cents flat would be 432.4Hz
Thanks, my earlier searches came up empty, but I have now been edumacated. It helps to have the right word to search Wiki.
So has he given you a time estimate? I bet you’re excited…
no he has not. im not sure how long it will take, but he’ll only be boring out 3 bells so i cant so it being to long. I am for sure excited! I’ll be defiantly sending future K horns to him. Next on my list is to buy either a K5L or K5HL.
Bell #1 after first cut. Photo Sent by Mr. Muha
Wow…, being all cast, I never thought you could mount a K horn in a lathe like that. Must be a bit of stuffing around to get it to turn true to centre.
I hope you’ve got a sound clip before you sent it to Mike. It’d be interesting to hear a before and after. Hey does he mention how long the bells will expect to hold pitch? I imagine that eventually with wear and age on the metal that they must wander a bit in their tune.
Another photo from mike: On the CNC mill in-process step-boring; #3a bell
^^^ Haha looks like about 50 cents worth of work.
Any idea why a step bore instead of the same diameter as the rest of the chamber?
something i found on horn and whistle.
“The factory tuning on the 3a bell as shipped today from Nathan is quite sharp. Problem is, there really isn’t enough material to make the existing pocket deeper to get to G#. Here is a photo of a 3A bell tuned to G# this morning using a smaller (and of course) deeper pocket to achieve the correct note.”
Ahhh ok. I wondered if you just run out of casting at the larger diameter.
an email from mike.
Your K5LA is tuned. Most of the sour sound you experienced (“dying animal”) was caused by the large mismatch between the 1 and 5 bells. The mismatch amounted to approximately a semitone, which is probably the worst possible combination, kind of like banging adjacent keys on a piano. That is the same reason that the new-cast P5 sounds so bad - a semitone separation between the 3 and 4 bells. Eliminate this, and most of the discord is gone. That being said, I also tuned the 3A bell which was quite sharp, and the 4A bell which was also sharp. The 2 bell and 5 bell were left alone at F#-30 and D#-30 and the other bells were tuned to the same “bias” relative to their advertised notes so as to preserve the chord structure, just transposed 30 cts down. I think it actually sounds better than the “standard” K5LA, but to hear any difference, you would have to compare in real time. If you sound your tuned horn it sounds like a perfectly tuned K5LA that is blowing the advertised notes.